Curse

Riotgear · Aug 08, 2007, 01:48 AM // 01:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seamus Finn

Still confused about this. Most likely = once every thirty seconds?

Expunge + Deadly Paradox = 15 second recharge.

There's often a copy of Rend or Gaze in the build somewhere too.

Nebuchadnezzer · Aug 08, 2007, 01:53 AM // 01:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seamus Finn

Still confused about this. Most likely = once every thirty seconds? And furthermore, since when has halls not been build wars? I am not defending the build, I could care less about it. But it hasn't impressed me when I had to monk against it, and I don't consider myself an amazing monk either.

The N/A builds usually carries Expunge, Gaze, and Rend now. So no, not once every 30 seconds.

C2K · Aug 08, 2007, 03:21 AM // 03:21

Sounds to me like Deadly Paradox is what makes Spirit rift spiking work well. It seems to be a catalyst for the spike allowing teams to spike more frequently with both Ancestor's Rage and Spirit Rift.

Perhaps if Deadly Paradox had a higher recharge and a lower duration, maybe that would slow down Rit Spike.

Nebuchadnezzer · Aug 08, 2007, 03:23 AM // 03:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by C2K

Perhaps if Deadly Paradox had never left the design phase because it was a terrible idea that had lead to many design flaws, we wouldnt have so many problems.

Fixed it.

Seamus Finn · Aug 08, 2007, 04:20 AM // 04:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by InfernalSuffering

Empathetic Removal currently requires you to target other ally. Limits it a lot.

If it didn't would it really be "Empathic Removal"?

And on the guardian topic:

50% block is basically as good as 75% block. The idea is teh enemy is going to miss the big deep wound + finisher combo or KD combo etc. The 25% difference is rally more like a 5% difference as far as how the skills will work in practice, but now one is a 10 energy elite, with a7 sec recharge, and one is 5 energy, non elite, wiht a 2 sec recharge. The armor is somewhat notable but in this case... yeah. Also, making a skill so good that every monk will bring it and then buffing something so that every warrior HAS to bring it isn't a very good approach to balancing. It's basically the Aegis/Mirror relationship but worse.

C2K · Aug 08, 2007, 09:00 AM // 09:00

If they are going to nerf Shield of Deflection, then they probably would nerf AoM as well, since AoM dervishes are immune to Blind. While I know SoD is effective against all Physical damage, its the easiest way to thwart an AoM Dervish build that is very popular in GvG.

BlackSephir · Aug 08, 2007, 10:08 AM // 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by InfernalSuffering

Assassin:
Shadow Form: Change “and all attacks against you miss” to “and all attacks against you are blocked”

Oh yeah, because Shadow Form is so overpowered and abused often... Oh wait, it totally isn't!

If you want to nerf Assa first make his other elites somewhat useful.
Wastrel's Collaps- what the hell...
Seeping Wound- 1-3,4 health degen, CONDITIONAL- gotta be teh bestest elite evah!

TheOneMephisto · Aug 08, 2007, 10:57 AM // 10:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by C2K

Perhaps if Deadly Paradox had a higher recharge and a lower duration, maybe that would slow down Rit Spike.

Perhaps if deadly paradox was ripped into shreads and thrown into a lake with a 500 pound weight around it's neck...

Deadly paradox is the worst skill ever, that entirely destroys any chance of trying to balance deadly and shadow arts.

Riotgear · Aug 08, 2007, 11:35 AM // 11:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

Seeping Wound- 1-3,4 health degen, CONDITIONAL- gotta be teh bestest elite evah!

I always have to laugh at that because my brother seems to think that's a good skill. ZOMG SEEPING + BSS + TWISTING FANGS EQUALS LEET DEGEN!!!

Yeah I guess. This is the same person who thinks signet+smite+banish smiting is leet, and runs Mark of Instability + Something + Twisting Fangs + Falling Spider + Critical Strike on a Moebius bar, and won't run Death Blossom instead because it's too expensive. No, he's not carrying BLS, or Impale either. Head asplode.

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Talk:Seeping_Wound

Funny how many people are mistaking that POS for a good skill.

BlackSephir · Aug 08, 2007, 11:51 AM // 11:51

Another Assa thingie, this- http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Wild_Strike
I'd like to see that changed to "and cannot be blocked, lulz"
Reason? http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Wild_Blow

I don't care if the +dmg will be removed or recharge time increased, I want it unblockable.

Thomas.knbk · Aug 08, 2007, 11:52 AM // 11:52

Some changes that stood out to me

Quote:

Originally Posted by InfernalSuffering

Here’s my “Wishlist" for 5 skills from each profession:

Ranger:
...
Rampage As One: Change to "For 3…15 seconds, both you and your animal companion attack 33% faster." 15 – 0 – 10
...
Mesmer:
Blackout: For 2…5 seconds, all of target foe’s skills are disabled, and all of your skills are disabled for 5 seconds.
...
Necromancer
Mark of Subversion: Decrease recharge time to 15 seconds.
...
Warrior
Warrior’s Cunning: Decrease energy cost to 5. Decrease recharge to 30 seconds.
...
Dervish:
Mystic Regeneration: Add “Lose all enchantments clause” to beginning.
...
Assassin:
...
Shadow Form: Change “and all attacks against you miss” to “and all attacks against you are blocked”
...
Monk:
Guardian: Decrease casting time to ¼ second.
...

Rampage As One: That's an even better uptime/energy rate than the old one. Too good.
Blackout: You're basically saying we should lose the touch clause on this? That would make it kinda too easy to shut down a monk on a spike, wouldn't it?
Mark of Subversion: Still a bad skill. For this to be effective, you need to be able to predict the cast, but if I can do that 2 seconds in advance, I'll use Diversion instead. Much better.
Warrior's Cunning: How about nerfing Aegis and Ward against Melee instead of giving warriors a way around it?
Mystic Regeneration: Doesn't that kinda defeat the point of this skill?
Shadow Form: That won't do anything. I know there are skills that cannnot be blocked etc, but you're not going to kill a sin with those alone. In order to kill a SF sin now you need to 'spike' during it's downtime, and with this change you will still have to.
Guardian: Wow. I have to go with Seamus Finn on this one. That's rediculous.

urania · Aug 08, 2007, 12:55 PM // 12:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

Another Assa thingie, this- http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Wild_Strike
I'd like to see that changed to "and cannot be blocked, lulz"
Reason? http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Wild_Blow

I don't care if the +dmg will be removed or recharge time increased, I want it unblockable.

they have expose for that.

BlackSephir · Aug 08, 2007, 12:58 PM // 12:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

they have expose for that.

And as I see it, expose is about to get nerfed to hell. Besides, if you haven't noticed, Wild Strike is to break stances, expose defenses is not.

Another funny thing
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Wild_Throw
Even friggin Paragon has stance-breaking skill that CANNOT be blocked.
But meele character, Assassin with Wild Strike that REQUIRES lead attack first has a stance-breaking skill but can be blocked.
Boo-frikkin-hoo.

moko · Aug 08, 2007, 01:00 PM // 13:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by urania

they have expose for that.

warriors cunning. still, it NEEDS to be unblockable, else it makes ZERO sense.

Quote:

If you watch the N/A you can. If you watch any team and try to actively taken ote of how their strategizing, its not much of a problem. Most skills are the same, its how you play them.

Dont assume just because your having problems with So and So build/skill that it must be broken and everyone who doesnt agree with you hasnt played against that build.

Theirs a reason Anet doesnt answer to certain skill changes that everyone complains about.

stop talking trash again. you can't watch it, you gotta beat the shit out of it on spikes and that's either only possible with casters or you gotta disrupt it which is hard due to paradox with a ranger, but either way -> buildwars.

Thomas.knbk · Aug 08, 2007, 02:28 PM // 14:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

warriors cunning. still, it NEEDS to be unblockable, else it makes ZERO sense.

That would only help against block stances. And against those it's kind of a stupid skill, because you need your lead attack to hit first.

BlackSephir · Aug 08, 2007, 03:09 PM // 15:09

It still would be more useful than it is now. Besides, P's and W's stance-breaking skills are unblockable, why A's should be blockable?

Another skill that I think needs changes is http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Malicious_Strike

Now it is somewhat... meh.
I'd change it to off-hand attack that hits only when attacked foe is suffering from a condition. I'll leave the rest.
Now it's pretty much useless, this way it'd be nice conditional off-hand.

InfernalSuffering · Aug 08, 2007, 04:28 PM // 16:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas.knbk

Some changes that stood out to me

Rampage As One: That's an even better uptime/energy rate than the old one. Too good.

I took out the movement speed increase which made these builds unkiteable. Now you have to take a speed boost skill such as Run As One to have the same effect. Makes them burn another slot on their skill bar.

Quote:

Blackout: You're basically saying we should lose the touch clause on this? That would make it kinda too easy to shut down a monk on a spike, wouldn't it?

I wouldnt say it makes it easier to shut down a monk on a spike, but that its more effective. Instead of giving them a negative effect on the for casting through it like diversion and shame, it doesnt let them do anything at all. More of a punishment for having a really bad midline who doesnt see the spike coming and interrupt it.

Quote:

Mark of Subversion: Still a bad skill. For this to be effective, you need to be able to predict the cast, but if I can do that 2 seconds in advance, I'll use Diversion instead. Much better.

I thought to update it to the same as Shame through MoR, but I forgot about the fast casting on mesmers. =/ Probably would need to be 1 second.

Quote:

Warrior's Cunning: How about nerfing Aegis and Ward against Melee instead of giving warriors a way around it?

I also nerfed ward of melee but with Aegis's long casting time and the many ways to remove it, I dont think it should be that much of a problem.

Quote:

Mystic Regeneration: Doesn't that kinda defeat the point of this skill?

Not at all. Not only does it give it a lot of synergy with dervish enchantments that give bonuses on their ending, but it allows for a gradual increase in the ammount of health regen you gain as opposed to a constant 10 pip regen which just screams imba.

Quote:

Shadow Form: That won't do anything. I know there are skills that cannnot be blocked etc, but you're not going to kill a sin with those alone. In order to kill a SF sin now you need to 'spike' during it's downtime, and with this change you will still have to.

While its still not perfect it gives sins with Shattering Assault or expose defenses and warriors with warriors cunning or sun and moon slash time to take them down easily. Not perfect but it might discourage some teams from running them.

Quote:

Guardian: Wow. I have to go with Seamus Finn on this one. That's rediculous.

Are you saying that this doesnt put it on par with RoF? At 12 prot, RoF can save 134 damage assuming its maxed out, which on a spike it would be. Guardian on the other hand, give you a "chance" to stop some of their spike. Figuring the average evis spike is ~155 damage plus deep wound even if you block two of the three (Evis, Exe, Agonizing) you still dont save as much damage. With changes in shutdown and prevention it shouldnt be that much of a problem anyways. Like I said earlier...might need to up the recharge, but the only thing changing it the cast time. The blocking mechanism is still the same as it is currently.

BlackSephir · Aug 08, 2007, 05:02 PM // 17:02

Maybe I missed something big and important and all but... what the hell's wrong with Shadow Form?

Nebuchadnezzer · Aug 08, 2007, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

Maybe I missed something big and important and all but... what the hell's wrong with Shadow Form?

Other then it being an annoyingly gimmicky skill that gets really get annoying when combined with Deadly paradox(albeit Deadly paradox completely screwed up alot of sin skills because it was a terrible idea). The only other problem is the very narrow amount of "counters" to it. Suggesting everyone take some form of skill only that removes an enchant for this silly skill is just ridiculous.

BlackSephir · Aug 08, 2007, 06:30 PM // 18:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nebuchadnezzer

Other then it being an annoyingly gimmicky skill that gets really get annoying when combined with Deadly paradox(albeit Deadly paradox completely screwed up alot of sin skills because it was a terrible idea). The only other problem is the very narrow amount of "counters" to it. Suggesting everyone take some form of skill only that removes an enchant for this silly skill is just ridiculous.

Oh, I get it now. It looks like making another A elite skill even less useful and more risky than it is now is now called 'fixing'.
I'd take a shortcut if I were you guys.
"Shadow Form- Elite Enchantment Spell- After 5...17...20 seconds you lose all but 5...41...50 Health."